Wasted in the heat

OFFICIAL MLB 2018 Thread

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5 hours ago, BillyB said:

Just looked up Miguel Cabrera stats.  He's one the highest paid players ever.  He will be making $30 million dollars or more per season until 2023.  Last season he had the same amount of Home Runs as Mets Catcher Travis D'Arnaud.

Now....obviously the Tigers ownership are responsible for giving a player such a contract. Also, Cabrera had a much better 2016...38 homers, over 100 ribbys.  So not unreasonable to expect a better 2018.  But at $30 million per...it's gotta open some eyes when a player puts out the numbers Cabrera did last year.  His last two contracts covering 2008 thru 2023 will have paid him over $400million dollars.  

Since he signed his first big contract in 2008....the Tiger have made the WS once...and were swept by the Giants. This also should raise an owner eyebrow or two...at least from the owners that want to win.

Last night I watched an MLB story of the life and career of the late great Tony Gwynn.   This should be mandatory viewing for today's players. Especially the guys who think getting an offer of $25 million per season is something to get upset over.

Here is his contract - http://www.spotrac.com/mlb/detroit-tigers/miguel-cabrera-285/

8 year deal for a 32 YO is starting to look like a stone around the teams neck. He's not the first one. Teams are now reluctant to make long-term commitments much past 35 or 36.

If you are Detroit, what's your total payroll project out to be, based on home gate, TV, etc? $175mm? less? more? Then tie up 16-17% of that in one player? What kind of TEAM can you then put on the field?

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44 minutes ago, JimCT said:

Here is his contract - http://www.spotrac.com/mlb/detroit-tigers/miguel-cabrera-285/

8 year deal for a 32 YO is starting to look like a stone around the teams neck. He's not the first one. Teams are now reluctant to make long-term commitments much past 35 or 36.

If you are Detroit, what's your total payroll project out to be, based on home gate, TV, etc? $175mm? less? more? Then tie up 16-17% of that in one player? What kind of TEAM can you then put on the field?

Agree 100%.

It's taken awhile, but teams are figuring out that the chances to win it all goes down when you sign guys for that much money.  I expect Cabrera to bounce back some...but for that kind of $$$ if he doesn't bat well over .300, hit 35+ homers and drive in 110 or more runs,  he ain't earning that kind of pay and I don't know if he'll ever hit those numbers ever again.  So the Tigers are stuck paying out another $180 million to a guy that isn't worth anywhere near that.  That is one large stone around their neck....it's their own doing of course.  But still a guy like JD Martinez apparently is crying over a $125million dollar offer....amazing.  Talk about having blinders on... 

It's stupid money...ridiculous money.   To pay that kind of cash and not win a WS game...it just doesn't compute.

But I can see why some players are pissed....I just read that back in 2016 their road 'meal money' was reduced from $100 to $30 a day.  Can you imagine being a guy like Cabrera...making $30 million a year...and then getting $30 bucks a day for meal money?  He better be tipping he clubhouse attendants big bucks...lol.

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1 hour ago, JimCT said:

Here is his contract - http://www.spotrac.com/mlb/detroit-tigers/miguel-cabrera-285/

8 year deal for a 32 YO is starting to look like a stone around the teams neck. He's not the first one. Teams are now reluctant to make long-term commitments much past 35 or 36.

If you are Detroit, what's your total payroll project out to be, based on home gate, TV, etc? $175mm? less? more? Then tie up 16-17% of that in one player? What kind of TEAM can you then put on the field?

Can you say Albert Pulous

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So many owners are pressured to give out these large contracts for "past performances", and not what they can expect out them in the life of the new contract. Cardinals just did this with Molina.

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17 minutes ago, Jimmy James said:

Can you say Albert Pulous

Another great example.  

He's had a fantastic career.  First ballot Hall of Famer for sure.

But he's owed like $114 million dollars on his contract that runs through 2021 when he turns 41.  He's production is trending down and will most likely continue to do so.  

Since he signed with the Angels in 2012....they have made exactly one playoff appearance and were swept in a divisional series vs the Royals back in 2014.

Again...the owners should and I think have taken responsibility for these types of deals.  Knowing how poorly it has worked out in almost every case, they are wising up.  The players need to wake up to reality. When they do, they'll realize that they will still be making ridiculous amounts of money. How they can complain about just about anything is beyond my understanding.

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3 hours ago, BillyB said:

 

But he's owed like $114 million dollars on his contract that runs through 2021 when he turns 41. 

41:rolleyes::D:D, he has lied about his age since the 7th grade. Let's just say 44.

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When your home fan base gets regularly shown up.....:lol::lol:

 

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16 hours ago, Power13 said:

When your home fan base gets regularly shown up.....:lol::lol:

 

Bruce Springsteen announces Giants Stadium stand, pre-sale in Mississippi.

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The Stove is officially lit.....finally. 

Cubs sign Darvish to 6 yr / $126M deal. Can’t say as I am disappointed in that...number of years may be a bit long, but the $$ seems reasonable. (Well, reasonable in terms of what sports figures ar making these days). 

 

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3 hours ago, Power13 said:

The Stove is officially lit.....finally. 

Cubs sign Darvish to 6 yr / $126M deal. Can’t say as I am disappointed in that...number of years may be a bit long, but the $$ seems reasonable. (Well, reasonable in terms of what sports figures ar making these days). 

 

I know it's just one signing, but I think the Cubs are the team that blinked first.  I can't imagine Darvish had this offer in his pocket all through this weirdly quiet free agent period.  If teams were trying to draw some sort of line in the sand on long term deals to the over 30 set, the Cubs gave in first.   I'd really love to know all the steps taken by the Cubs, Darvish and other teams involved that led to this conclusion.  

Now...if they win it all in the next two years I guess it would be 'worth it'.... but I predict that Darvish isn't gonna be putting up $20 million dollar numbers for at least the last 3 years of this deal.  But good for him...he doubled his salary and is on another team that's primed for a WS run.  But if he performs in the WS for the Cubs, like he did for the Dodgers and they lose, this deal will not look so good to Cub fans...IMO.

 

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29 minutes ago, BillyB said:

I know it's just one signing, but I think the Cubs are the team that blinked first.  I can't imagine Darvish had this offer in his pocket all through this weirdly quiet free agent period.  If teams were trying to draw some sort of line in the sand on long term deals to the over 30 set, the Cubs gave in first.   I'd really love to know all the steps taken by the Cubs, Darvish and other teams involved that led to this conclusion.  

Now...if they win it all in the next two years I guess it would be 'worth it'.... but I predict that Darvish isn't gonna be putting up $20 million dollar numbers for at least the last 3 years of this deal.  But good for him...he doubled his salary and is on another team that's primed for a WS run.  But if he performs in the WS for the Cubs, like he did for the Dodgers and they lose, this deal will not look so good to Cub fans...IMO.

 

6 years for a 31 YO pitcher isn't too bad. He's already had Tommy John surgery, so that's behind him not in his future (I hope!).

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5 hours ago, BillyB said:

I know it's just one signing, but I think the Cubs are the team that blinked first.  I can't imagine Darvish had this offer in his pocket all through this weirdly quiet free agent period.  If teams were trying to draw some sort of line in the sand on long term deals to the over 30 set, the Cubs gave in first.   I'd really love to know all the steps taken by the Cubs, Darvish and other teams involved that led to this conclusion.  

Now...if they win it all in the next two years I guess it would be 'worth it'.... but I predict that Darvish isn't gonna be putting up $20 million dollar numbers for at least the last 3 years of this deal.  But good for him...he doubled his salary and is on another team that's primed for a WS run.  But if he performs in the WS for the Cubs, like he did for the Dodgers and they lose, this deal will not look so good to Cub fans...IMO.

 

The numbers getting bandied about early in FA were potentially up to $30M / year for guys like Arrietta and Darvish...certainly $25M+.  I don’t know if there is a meaningful difference between a 4 year deal at a higher average or a longer deal at a lower average....you can make an argument both ways. 

Like I said, my first reaction was “huh...not too bad on the $$.”  FWIW, my neighbor (who works for the Cubs) had the same reaction (his is not in the front office, so has no significant prior knowledge of this stuff). 

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He could throw that (curve) ball by ya...make you look like a fool, boy

 

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So if you are Maddon, what is your rotation from these 5 guys....Darvish, Kyle Hendricks, Lester, Quintana and Tyler Chatwood. 

Chatwood is obviously the 5th guy no matter what....personally I would go Darvish, Quinatana, Lester, Hendricks and then Chatwood.  You can make a case for any of the first four to go into any of those 4 slots. 

This is NOT a bad problem to have! B) 

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18 hours ago, JimCT said:

6 years for a 31 YO pitcher isn't too bad. He's already had Tommy John surgery, so that's behind him not in his future (I hope!).

I too hope he stays healthy.  But I still have strong doubts about how well he will be pitching over the last half of the contract. 

There have been some...but not many pitchers that stayed at or near the top of their game after turning 35.  Roger Clemons comes to mind as a recent one...but he cheated a lot. 

 

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50 minutes ago, BillyB said:

I too hope he stays healthy.  But I still have strong doubts about how well he will be pitching over the last half of the contract. 

There have been some...but not many pitchers that stayed at or near the top of their game after turning 35.  Roger Clemons comes to mind as a recent one...but he cheated a lot. 

 

Mussina went 20-9 w/3.37 ERA pitching 200 innings at 39. And walked away. But that's the exception, not the rule.

37 is not so bad as an endpoint. They may have concluded that if they get 5 good years and the last one isn't that the overall deal is acceptable

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So where does Arrietta end up now?  Milwaukee and Nats both being mentioned as front-runners now.  Arrietta on the Nats rotation could be formidable. 

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31 minutes ago, RummagingBedouin said:

Jim, do you go to any Grapefruit League games?

 

Last year we went to the Yankees at the Nats at the new facility, lovely. 

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Cubs reportedly were close to deal w/ Darvish @ 5 yrs/ $125M, but persuaded him to go extra year for same $$, plus incentives.  

Can be viewed as either good or bad, but shows how well Theo & Co can negotiate. 

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Oh....and Pitchers & Catchers report today.

Image result for celebrate gif

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